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lorri

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PostSubject: To spay or not to spay   Wed Oct 07, 2009 10:33 am

Hi we haven't had ellie or abi done but wondered what everybodys opinions on it is it better to leave them or get them done if you are not going to breed?? Ours are 2 and 3 now is it better to get it done when they are young?


Lorri
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ourfairview
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PostSubject: Re: To spay or not to spay   Wed Oct 07, 2009 11:09 am

ohhh what a subject!

personally i dont spay bitches, i know lots of people do but i think why operate if you dont need to???? there are risks if you do and risks if you dont!

i think if you can cope with the seasons eg the blood about the place then leave well alone, from what friends say a spey bitch isnt any better temprement wise, is alot harder to control in terms of weight gain and most end up slightly on the fat side even when fed the same as a not speyed bitch!

HOWEVER i am of course not against speying i would do it if it needed to be done and would say i think it depends on how responsable the owner is-YOU are the one who needs to protect you in season bitch from dogs and that can be a hard job esp if you live in a built up area with dogs all around you!

i know some breeders spey bitches after they are finished breeding but i wont until i have to- i think this is done so they can be sold on without the risk of having another litter- mine wont be sold on !!!

some people spay bitches very early before a first season some do it after so i dont think time wise they are too old i just think people dont think of it as such a big op because it is done so regularly, but it is!

i have a friend who has the opionion that they wont sell a bitch to be spayed " they dont do designer dogs!" i dont feel that way about it i just dont think its needed to be done as a matter of course,

all in all its upto you - ill be very interested to see what others say

( for what its worth i wouldnt castrate a dog for no reason either- if you see a castrated dog near a bitch in season to me they look sad, they know what they want to do but cant do it , they will never forget that erge and will always feel like they are missing something , to me a entire dog is much better being a pain in the backside than a dog who cant do his "job" !!! )

if in a medical way its needed it will be done- but not until then ..........

cheri
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lorri

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PostSubject: Re: To spay or not to spay   Wed Oct 07, 2009 12:13 pm

Thanx cheri and i think im with you i dont see the point in putting them through that for no reason espesially ellie as she has already had so many ops its just i,ve heard a couple of cases where one bitch died with mamoary tumours and the other with cant remember the name but its when the womb gets infected after a season and can be life threatning and the dog had to under go emergency surgery but she thankfully pulled through (non of these dogs were saints) it just got me thinking but i guess its a risk either way and having the op may be an unnecessary risk!!

Lorri
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cart5832002

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PostSubject: Re: To spay or not to spay   Wed Oct 07, 2009 1:31 pm

hi, i am so glad you started this topic as we had been thinking wether to have murphy castrated but have decided that as theres no reason to we arnt going to at the moment. we had thought about it as murphy still has his rear dew claws so they could be removed at the same time but after talking to the vet about them he said if they werent causing him any problems at the moment then why bother so we dont want to put murphy through an operation which he doesnt really need. mandy and murphy
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Saint



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PostSubject: Re: To spay or not to spay   Wed Oct 07, 2009 1:51 pm

I agree with Cheri on this.
I personally believe to leave well enough alone, If it is not causing them any problems.
We had three female boxers here with us who were never done.
They lived to be 14 years, 14 and a half years and 17 and a half years.

Regards to males, I knew someone who got their male done.
before this he was extremely quiet and gentle boy, but after the operation he was like a different dog and quite the opposite to what he was before!
Even a fly would send him into a frenzy. In the horse world, i think they call this a rick.
I'm not saying that this could happen to every dog but I for one would not take the risk.
Here we separate our females away from the males, but if you have no females in your home then I would really not worry about it and plus there is no stress in putting him under for an operation.

Sandra
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gina

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PostSubject: Re: To spay or not to spay   Wed Oct 07, 2009 2:13 pm

Hi All,

I dont know if this is breed specific but my mum has 2 cocker spaniel boys and she had them "done" (as advised by the vet) and there coats have gone really wooly and get matted very easily, thier breeder said it was because they had been castrated.
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SaintBernardinTexas

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PostSubject: Re: To spay or not to spay   Sat Jul 31, 2010 6:11 pm

I was reading through these posts and I was glad to come across this one. We have been weighing the pros and cons to fixing our male saint puppy. He is only 4 months right now, but were told by the vet to get it done around 6 months. On the other hand, my breeder told me not to fix him because studies have shown that males that were fixed before they were a year old did not grown to be all of the saint they could be. They were lankier and skinnier. She told me that he needed the testosterone pumping through his body to make him bulk up and reach the huge size he was meant to reach. I just wanted to get all of your opinions on this?

My Beau only had one testicle drop and the vet told me that if we waited that there was a chance on it being dangerous later on if he had to go up in the stomach and remove it. So I have this in the back of my head too.

Any thoughts would help! Thank you all for taking the time to read and respond!! Natalie sunny
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Mawreddog

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PostSubject: Re: To spay or not to spay   Sun Aug 01, 2010 2:45 pm

Hi Natalie
I haven't had any of my boys done but I have bred a puppy who had only 1 testicle descend & they have recently had him neutered.
They also had his litter brother done at the same time, who had both testicles in situ.
The one with just one testicle did suffer a bit more after as they had had to dig about for the missing one so I guessed he was a bit bruised.
I have it on good authority that if the vet doesn't shave the area they recover much quicker, as they get no shaving rash & therefore don't have the inclination to nibble at the stiches so much Very Happy
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Vicki

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PostSubject: Re: To spay or not to spay   Sun Aug 01, 2010 4:09 pm

That's so true heather, when we had monty castrated he had awful clipper rash, we had a buster collar, his lead on and we both had to sleep downstairs with him to stop him biting at his stitches, it must have been so itchy for him Mad
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ourfairview
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PostSubject: Re: To spay or not to spay   Sun Aug 01, 2010 8:11 pm

oooooooo shaving rash lol!
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lora

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PostSubject: Re: To spay or not to spay   Wed Aug 04, 2010 4:57 pm

This article is VERY intersting and goes against alot of what we have been indoctrinated wtih!

http://www.naiaonline.org/pdfs/longtermhealtheffectsofspayneuterindogs.pdf

I feel sooo violated that our vets have pushed to have dogs done simply for population control reasons! The increased risks for dogs under one is staggering!
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Chasidyz

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PostSubject: Re: To spay or not to spay   Wed Aug 04, 2010 10:04 pm

yeah, but if you have pet insurance, they won't cover certain things if your dog isn't spayed or neutered by the time they are 1.

if my dog wasn't neutered before he was 1 and got hit by a car at 14 months, they wouldn't cover it because they would consider his running in the street to be "hormone driven," even if it was just excitement. they also won't cover anything if he runs away and gets injured if he isn't neutered by the age of 1, but if he is neutered by 1 year, they cover everything!

my weimaraner is 22 months and has had about $3000 in "accident" vet bills, and it would suck big time if we didn't have pet insurance to cover those, many of which the insurance company probably would have attributed to her "hormones" and not being spayed.

it sucks for sure, but pet insurance has been the best investment we've ever made, and to not have total coverage would just not be worth it!

i agree though, if it weren't for insurance, i would have waited. i think even vets are torn on this issue. some vets will do it at 8 weeks, some at 6 months, and i'm sure there are others that will wait even longer.
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Mawreddog

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PostSubject: Re: To spay or not to spay   Wed Aug 04, 2010 10:08 pm

In the uk there aren't the same rules regarding spaying/neutering & insurance.. they just don't cover any breeding related conditions
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Chasidyz

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PostSubject: Re: To spay or not to spay   Wed Aug 04, 2010 10:19 pm

they don't cover breeding related expenses here either, but any hormone-driven injuries or problems related to not having them spayed/neutered (like mammary tumors or prostate problems) also aren't covered. we finally found insurance that covers hip dysplasia and congenital/birth defects, (and they just gave us an unlimited lifetime coverage limit), so we are definitely sticking with them and will abide by their rules, unless we get a dog we intend to breed (someday I love you )

we still waited longer than our vet's recommendation of 6 months. we had our weim spayed at 11 months and our saint neutered at 9 months, both at the same time to keep them from trying to wrestle with each other while they had stitches. they both healed up no problem!

in regards to weight gain, proper exercise and diet will control that. most weight gain is just because their hormones aren't giving them the urge to search for a partner or run around all crazy, but walks and games and good exercise and mental stimulation can be just as effective, if not better, at keeping weight in check.

our weim was spayed nearly a year ago, and you can still see her ribs! (she eats like a horse, but she runs non-stop night and day!) and our saint is a very healthy weight ~140 pounds at 18 months old, and looks good and feels good too and we constantly get compliments on their soft coats. high quality food can make a big difference in coat quality too!

neither of or dogs temperaments changed after the surgery, and our saint has never humped anything, which, i must say, i am glad about! i remember being "attacked" multiple times by my male saint as a child, and it is terrifying to have a 150+ pound dog on you when you are 7 years old and can't get him off! Sad
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lora

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PostSubject: Re: To spay or not to spay   Mon May 02, 2011 12:57 pm

Since we have some new members on the board since this was last discussed I thought I would res-erect it. What are your thoughts on spay/neutering? Do benefits out weigh the risks and at what age does the trade off switch positions?

American vets have been pushing for 6 months across the board for years but more and more shelters and organizations are pushing for pediatric spay/neutering (@ 8 weeks). I posted a link a few months ago with risks and was shocked at what I found. Im soooo mad! B and R were done at 3 months (12 weeks) by their previous owner at the behest of the vet. Apollo and Zeus were done at 6 months on the dot. I was thinking I was being responsible and what was in their best interests. The only benefit I can see is that their sex organs didint mature and I dont have giant lipsticks hanging out when they sit down, sigh. Zeus had to be done at 6 months regardless, I didnt want him done but he was cryptorchid and the vet said they needed to come out before it because a difficult potentially risky surgery. Hera was done by the time I got her and she has severe spay incontinence due to being done too young. She is medicated but each year the dose goes up and I hate to say it but I have almost given up on her a few times because its so bad at times.

Here's the link again. Long Term Benefits of Spay and Neutering
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BernieSaintBernard



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PostSubject: Re: To spay or not to spay   Sun Feb 26, 2012 9:19 am

I'm not against breeding but I favor adoption more. This will save other homeless dogs which I think is right.
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ourfairview
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PostSubject: Re: To spay or not to spay   Sun Mar 11, 2012 10:01 pm

bumping to the top for cheryl xxx
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